Curse

Xero Silvam · Sep 04, 2005, 07:53 AM // 07:53

Okay, the first thing i'd like to say is that I', from holland and my spelling could be a little bad sometimes.
The second thing goed about all of your whining over the monk primaires and secondaires. When we saw the first real effective monk build, all monks were anxious to finally be able to solo harder things, such as griffons, and when they realized that was way to easy they went to the Uw/FoW. They made the economy unbalanced and made some things just too easy to get, like all the rare items from the uw and fow. Storm Bows arent even worth 2K anymore at max dmg, while they went for allot more before the monks/smite build.

Now, thats all in the past because the "nerfed" protective bond.
Now, finally some smart ass got it and used not a monk primaire, because he didnt even needed the runes, and took an elementalist, wich I used over 3 months ago btw, to go farming in the hard places.
Instead of the energy regeneration of Essence Bond and Balthazar's Spirit they now use Ether Renewal & Energy Storage for the large mana pool and the ability to fill it up in under 4 seconds. They only take 5% or 10%, depends on ur choise, damage, so their armor doesnt matter anymore. Hmm sounds like another invinci monk, not? Well why do I think that that isnt true then? Because this build has bin quite common in the game (atleast I think that) and as soon as the invinci monk was nerfed, the ex-invicis monks took the second best things and went with the elementalist.
Well we can either expect another pre-invincimonk era, or we can accept it and find our way to counter this build, cause again, its just as vulnurable in PvP as in PvE. I remember I had a Smite Monk in the mission Iron Mines of Moladune, and he had to stay back at every Mesmer/Necro/ect, simply because he died everytime he faced 1. PvP is thesame thing, use an enchantement removal and both Ether Renewal AND Balthazars Aura will be gone, ant then its a matter of bang bang and the elementalist is dead (atleast the avarage elementalist) So I dont see why you'd nerf them bcause they nerf PvP. In the UW and FOW its allot easier to implant 1 Mesmer creature and kick the crap out of the invici build then to nerf it and get everyone whining at certain forums.

So my sulution would be to put an Mesmer or any other enchantement stripping beast in front of the place where you spawn in the UW and FOW. This way they'd be either forced to use a counter and then the game evolves another round. Because its always the counter of the counter that makes the game evolve and be as good as it is.
Thats the game at its best, it evolves so that any build will not be able to dominate each other, simply because 1 of the 5 other professions will be able to counter them.

So plz, plz stop whining and think of some build that will effectivly shut down and kill the invinci monk (backfire any1?)

Flame me, do whatever you like, but plz be a bit rational.

Eonwe · Sep 04, 2005, 12:42 PM // 12:42

So what your post boils down is basically.... why not to nerf Ether Renewal. But unfortunately I can't think of any reason why the skill should not recieve a nerf.

Schorny · Sep 04, 2005, 12:42 PM // 12:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xero Silvam

They made the economy unbalanced and made some things just too easy to get, like all the rare items from the uw and fow. Storm Bows arent even worth 2K anymore at max dmg, while they went for allot more before the monks/smite build.

That is nonsense and I won't read further. Storm Bows where a long time before the invinci-monk was popular worth nothing.

And a godly storm bow is still worth a lot of money.

Please try to get your facts right.

Exar · Sep 04, 2005, 12:51 PM // 12:51

Quote:

And a godly storm bow is still worth a lot of money.

What you do is reading without understanding.
He meant the plain clean storm bow max. They used to cost 50-100k.

Youre bubbling about godly. Know what godly weapon is?
In case you dont
max, +15>50, sundering 10/10, fortitude +30, req 7
cheers

Odd Sock · Sep 04, 2005, 12:52 PM // 12:52

Who cares about the noob-bow anyways ?

He's telling us that Renewal and Renewal based builds (ahem smiters) are overpowered simply because Renewal makes you go on infinite energy if you know what you're doing.

Schorny · Sep 04, 2005, 01:07 PM // 13:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exar

What you do is reading without understanding.

For people who can read, there is an interesting line in my post, but for my friends, I'll quote it:

Quote:

Storm Bows where a long time before the invinci-monk was popular worth nothing.

Quote:

He meant the plain clean storm bow max. They used to cost 50-100k.

No, really? Man, that is amazing. I never knew there was a plain clean storm bow. That is really cool.

Quote:

Youre bubbling about godly. Know what godly weapon is?

No. I don't. I just heared that somewhere and I try to be cool. So I said something about godly to impress you.

Quote:

In case you dont
max, +15>50, sundering 10/10, fortitude +30, req 7
cheers

Oh, thank you sir. Now I know what I was talking about. Really kind of you.

Sorry, but what are you trying to do? Do you really think Storm Bows dropped from one day to the other from 100k to 100g? The invinci-monk has nothing to do with it. It is a simple conclusion and I will point it out for you:

The more people play this game for a longer period of time, the more get to UW/FoW and get stuff. And a clean Storm Bow isn't that hard to find. We normally find 3-4 Storm Bows when we go UW, not all of them are max damage, but eventually some of them. So Storm Bows are floating in the economy by regular play. And the more people to go UW/FoW, the more Storm Bows are floating around.

Eonwe · Sep 04, 2005, 01:23 PM // 13:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Exar

Youre bubbling about godly. Know what godly weapon is?
In case you dont
max, +15>50, sundering 10/10, fortitude +30, req 7

Just wanted to point something out to stop the spread of misinformation. That would be that Sundering is probably one of the worst mods you could put onto a weapon, and that in most cases Armor +5 is better than Health +30.

ElderAtronach · Sep 04, 2005, 02:14 PM // 14:14

If noobs want to throw their gold into a shitty bow that's worse than a collector's 15% in a stance bow, I guess that's their right.

Silmor · Sep 04, 2005, 02:17 PM // 14:17

If you had posted this in one of the many ongoing discussions about smite spam/Ether Renewal, you would've been able to read some actual solid pro- and con-rebalancing arguments on this issue. The only point you seem to be making is "I've been using it for a long while and I don't want them to nerf it". Well, good for you. That has nothing to do with balance, which should be the only concern for ArenaNet. Other than an a single unargumented opinion against rebalancing, you're not offering anything.

Thurston Killgore · Sep 04, 2005, 03:24 PM // 15:24

nerf the zealot's fire time...switch 30 seconds enchanted w/ 60 seconds to recharge..
and the reason why you want to nerf them..is because it dominates..
and it destroyed creative builds and balance within the game..
and honestly i hate the build itself..its more cookie cutter than the Air spike Build..
the e/mo's are healing and damaging all in one stroke... thats what makes it powerful..

Warskull · Sep 04, 2005, 04:55 PM // 16:55

I am not sure the OP really understands what the smite build is. It sounds like he is farming with it in PvE and doesn't want it nerfed again.

However the smite build was around before the 55/105 monk (not FotM like it is now, but it was still around.) The smite build that most people want nerfed is the draw conditions/reversal of fortune, zealot's fire spam smiter who uses ether renewal or infinite energy. Backfire doesn't solve the problem either, just turn on ether renewal and keep casting.

Phades · Sep 04, 2005, 06:29 PM // 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thurston Killgore

nerf the zealot's fire time...switch 30 seconds enchanted w/ 60 seconds to recharge..
[...]the e/mo's are healing and damaging all in one stroke... thats what makes it powerful..

Thats what mo/? or ?/mo do. They do something while doing something else. That is the power of enchantments. Your first line outlines the primary problem with enchantments in general. Your second line outlines the problem with monks in general when compared to every other job. Attack the source of the problem, not the thing that highlights what makes the problem proliferate. That is the difference between covering up the problem and fixing it.

*Heh, i cant wait till more monk skills come out and people figure out ways to power zealots with skills that affect the entire party efficiently. Talk about a recaulkulous skills.

Mercury Angel · Sep 04, 2005, 06:51 PM // 18:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eonwe

Just wanted to point something out to stop the spread of misinformation. That would be that Sundering is probably one of the worst mods you could put onto a weapon, and that in most cases Armor +5 is better than Health +30.

To be exact, Sundering weapon mod will add on average, a whopping 1% DPS against caster armor;

6 AL reduction = 10% damage bonus, happening in 1/10 hits.
10% extra damage once in 10 hits = 1% extra damage on average.

Just in case anyone wanted the hard numbers.

As for set health bonuses, they only matter if you're at 1-30 health; At 31 or more health, you'd have survived without the mod.
On the other hand, a +5 AL mod works to reduce damage from most sources by 8% constantly. It makes healing a little more efficient as well. (At the extremes, x2 life, and 1/2 damage reduction are about the same with no healing. However, healing 250 health is cheaper than 500.)

Anyway, I have an e/mo smiter RP char I've been using to farm for ages. The smiting strategies are counterable far more easily and without as many changes to builds as spirit spam by far.

However, Ether Renewal itself is in need of dire changes. It's not really useful enough on a pure elementalist, and is a way too potent energy engine elsewhere.

Almighty Zi · Sep 04, 2005, 09:01 PM // 21:01

In my opinion, Zealots Fire does not require rebalancing. Anet already did this when they stopped the trigger spam spells like Reversal Of Fortune and Draw Conditions by giving all spells a 1 second recharge time. Use ward against harm to reduce the damage and make ample use of diversion to take out the trigger spells.

The mainstay of most smiter builds are enchantments like Zealot's Fire, Balthazar's Aura and Ether Renewal and these beg to be removed. I accept that it is very difficult to remove all the enchantments on a smiter heavy team but the more enchantment removing you do, the more damage reduction you are performing as well as limiting their self healing and energy gaining capabilities.

The auras only effect the area around the caster so they have to come close to you in order to inflict damage with these. Use this to your advantage and use your own area of effect spells to deter them from going after your healers. I also believe that good use of healing seed goes a long way to reducing the damage of the auras.

cookiehoarder · Sep 05, 2005, 12:45 AM // 00:45

You Dont Nerf Smite Because You Can Just Rend The Enchantments!!!!!!!!

Simath · Sep 05, 2005, 01:16 AM // 01:16

One build will ALWAYS dominate. No matter what you nerf, there will always be a build that will dominate. They nerfed spirit spammers, everyone was happy for about a hour or two. Then smiters started to dominate, now everyone is complaining about them. You know what, nerf them, then you people will find something else to complain about.

A build gets nerfed leads to a differen't build dominating and it keeps going. You will always have somethign to complain about.

Legendary Battousai · Sep 05, 2005, 01:31 AM // 01:31

well something looks effective, fun and easy to do, LETS NERF THE F*** OUT OF IT!.... geeze thats all that happens now a days....

Thomasuwoo · Sep 05, 2005, 01:40 AM // 01:40

If you can't see how horreuosly overpowered ether renewal and balths are (in combination, without ether renewal balths would be easy to counter) then you obviously run kit and don't want it changed.
I'd be happy if they just added an exhastion cost to balths to stop it from working so well with ether renewal

.
And if the Hp regen was removed from ether renewal or given a % like aura The energy wouldn't matter. We'd be able to kill the damn thing while inturpting their monks and chiblainsing and stripping the spammer while healing ourselves. We do all this now, coupled with rend so we have an easy target... It's the other 2 emo's on the team that we we have trouble with. Trying to out damage and heal a smite team is not easy work.

Phrozenflame · Sep 05, 2005, 01:46 AM // 01:46

I guess some ppl are just pissed of after the monk nerf and dun wanna see anything close the new monk solo built.. :-/

Apolinario · Sep 05, 2005, 01:51 AM // 01:51

All this crying about certain builts will lead to certain death of the game. The developers will not be able to satisfy everyone's request. I see the death of GW sooner than anticipated.